May 12, 2018. might be ok for a black bear, but will likely piss off a coastal bear. All good options. Mountain lions are normally very secretive and cautious. Did they field dress and later skin it ? And no, I do not bother with bear spray. When I head afield, I nearly always carry one form of sidearm or another, and while the truly dangerous encounters are definitely a rarity, I feel better knowing I can protect my loved ones and coworkers should the event unfold. At the same time, we're trying to be as supportive and helpful to property owners as possible.". I use it on my sailboat for protection in the Bahamas, to take out boat engines. The third racoons I shot was hit behind the heart lung area with a 7.62x 25 , it flinched from the shot, turned, growled, and continued towards a timbered embankment and possible escape. In ordinary life, people are much more likely to be attacked by another person, than by a mountain lion. Under normal circumstances, the lion would have returned to eat the prey. The key is putting the projectile in the right spot. Yes I admit this was a freak happening. With respect to the brownies, I have reached out to the bear guides, residents and hunters for their wisdom and experience on the matter, to find out exactly which sidearms they favor and why. I know Phil has seen more bears killed than I ever will, but he got lucky. That said, the 4-3-1 is a simple and effective rule of thumb. They are most active between dusk and dawn, and generally avoid contact with humans. After watching a grizzly tear apart a moose calf in the Tetons I took my s&w .40 to a pawn shop and traded it for a .41 magnum Taurus tracker with a 4 ported barrel, The S&W .500 was too heavy to carry while hiking. My mountain weapon is a 458 SOCOM, semi-auto, from a 8in barrel, eotech halo-graphic, green laser and 1000 lumen light, with a 300gr lead tip hollow point. There are videos out there that show this gun/ammo combo going through both sides of the current US Army helmet. and driving a rig your not in the Alaskan brush. 200gr LRN out of my G29 or EAA Elite Match. Too many horses, the federal government says, are crowding the scraps of . 6+1 capacity, and will group within 3 inches at 25 yds. FL). Go to any gunshop youll find plenty of all those calibers for sale, used with very low round counts, wonder why? Flat shooting gun with a lifetime warranty. Mountain lions have a size advantage, a power advantage, and more weapons in their arsenal to kill a wolf. . National Park Service, via AP, FILE. Incidentally I have 2 500 Smith mags, never carry them in bear country. and females' territories can range up to 60 square miles. reviews, Its got the velocity, but wonder if it would have the penetration? Why not? Mr. Shoemakers observations about irrational fear, opinions based on nonexperience or shilling, and the need for multiple hits in a hurry are the most astute and real world in this series. I have killed over 140 head of big game in Australia, waterbuffalo, moose, elk, deer, antelope, hogs, exotics, many black bear, and one charging brown bear in Alaska at 5 feet with a hand gun. .38 Special is great . 44 mag power in a high cap auto loader. My handloads push a 200gr hardcast bullet to just under 1300fps. I finally settled on attempting to use Hodgden Universal powder for the first go, since it shows the potential to give good velocity with the lighter 170-grain bullets. Mountain lions weigh up to 198lbs, reach 30 mph at top speed, and only bite with a force of about 400 PSI. The 400gr cowboy loads are mild and I could shoot them all day. Babb said the attack occurred while the boy and his family were taking a break from riding all-terrain vehicles. Worse is the comment on using a .38 Spl in bear country is better then no gun: BS, if your not prepared, dont go! Mountain lions dont have a reputation for requiring powerful firearms to put them down. However, please dont cast aspersions toward those who have done their own homework and made their own best choices. 66% of kills among collared mountain lions were mule deer. Is it a powerhouse, as a bear cartridge? Id have gladly traded it for a snub-nose .38 Special. An interesting side note is that after a bear has been skinned and hung up, if you come upon the scene unexpectedly you would think that you are looking at a dead man. If you can't gain proficiency and carry something of reasonable power level, then go with spray. The shop will have something to shoot almost every time regardless of where you are. I would take a 357 Magnum with hard cast bullets over a standard 45 Colt round. Mine rides in a Diamond D Guides Choice model. I simply killed her with kindness, responding: for the same reason you dont buy bathroom tissue, one sheet at a time, MAMM. A doe once got a hoof caught in the top of a cyclone fence, near our property. Back in the 70s, this form of competition was only for revolvers. This is why I prefer my .460 Roland it has compensator for better follow on second shot. Keith by Buffalo Bore . There were teams of men racing across Alaska. Now before we take a look at particular models and calibers, lets get one basic premise out of the way: when the excrement hits the oscillator, any gun is better than no gun. If you put a 6.25 inch barrel on the glock 20 it is very capable of stopping most large animals. The Blackhawk is tough as nails, and while it may not have the prestige of a Colt Single Action Army, it is utterly dependable. Mountain lions can kill adult humans along with large mammals. ( Watch a Florida panther pass . In most cases, a 22 caliber rifle will not be able to kill a mountain lion. The cowboy loads are mild and fun to shoot and loaded with 300 plus grain hot loads it is very similar to a 44 mag. Winchester lists their .410 GA slugs as 1800 feet per second. An old farm fence stopped the bear at 11 yards and gave me the chance to get that cap on. The only real downside is there is not a good rifle to go with the 10 mm. With a 5 inch un-ported barrel, 300 grain hard cast solids, cut an X on the point with a fine hack saw about 1/8 of an inch deep. Loaded with good ammunition, either of these Smith & Wesson .44 Magnums will make excellent bear medicine. is excellent. The female mountain lion in a chilling faceoff with a solo trail runner in Utah wasn't trying to kill him. C. After a Loss Depredation Permit Process. With the right bullet most large caliber handguns will end the confrontation in your favor if done this way. False economy at that point. .45 Colt may be questionable, but better than a .38. The entire time I was a patrol officer, 5 years, I carried a revolver. Just aim above the front tire, through the fender taking out the engine block. Despite the firepower, these guys all tried to avoid brown bear encounters. A 22 may kill a mountain lion, but a 44 magnum will kill their soul as well. While hunting is one of my favorite pastimes, fishing and hiking are a wonderful means of spending time with friends and family and living in close proximity to both the Catskill and Adirondack mountains, there is ample opportunity for both of those activities. And, take the time and professional training to get to know how it feels to defend yourself in a close-combat type of scenario. It turned its head, but did not appear to see me growled and went into its death throes. But it is is at an angle to wind between about 1 degree and 360 degrees, your changes are slim to none. They are considered important in maintaining ecosystems and controlling other animal populations such as deer, its preferred prey. On a personal note I dont like I would also explore all the different kinds ammo available that would be the best for an attack by a bear. Curiosity got the better of them, and they managed to discharge the canisters in their hotel room that night. Anyway, Ive had my share of sleepless nights in a tent in Alaska and try to heed to basics keep food well away from camp, cook away from camp, dont camp on trails, avoid cubs like the plague, if approached give ground, etc. My only proof of that assertion goes back 17 years when I was unkowingly walking my blind dog very near a collared grizzly sow with two cubs. Remember you can be turned into bear shit with in two days if you are wrong! Good luck It is not as if that information is widely out there ..This is part of a Strategy. The lion did not attack further and the boys uncle shot at the cat. Yes and no.. She attacked the 65-pound animal, striking . It is the gun I used in the American Hunter Challenge Video where I make five hits at seven yards in under three seconds. But please.no one has mentioned marine flares..is the problem that they do not work or that they are too slow to activate. He agreed the animal was huge. Seeing the bull moose charging froze me. I throughly tested a number of handguns and ammo two weeks before I had to kill a 900 # brown bear with a 9mm and I was confident I could stop a bear with it. Chances are youll only get to use one? Any suggestion that a 9mm or 357 magnum is any gun better than none in brown bear country is ridiculous. The BS in this article is deep. Although the species is protected, landowners can request a special permit to catch or kill a mountain lion if it has killed livestock and caused damage. .357 magnum will probably work as long as you're not running into any bears .44 magnum is preferable. mountain lion primarily subsists on large ungulates, small mammals including porcupine, hares and rabbits, ground squirrels, and beaver may also supplement its diet. Id never seen tracks that huge. I wasnt sure if the .357 was really optimal for bear spanking as my father, a hunter and 23 year US Army Combat Veteran would say and couldnt bring myself to splurge on either 10mm or something in the .44 magnum ranges. Found the bullet in the other ear, Weighed 270 grains. Yes I admit, Im a revolver person. Robert Rourke famously said, Use enough gun.. Especially when you carry an extra mag. I enjoyed the article. A Utah friend of mine called to ask about using a .38 Special with a 4" barrel as a trail gun and a defensive gun in the mountains of his home state. However, two of those incidents resulted in fatalities. Its not the bear in the fight, its the fight in the bear. Ive ditch my .460 Rowland. I have a hard time believing when pressed in close quarters, that they would do well with a .410 load in the face. For those worried/concerned about the weight of their weapon, I can say this, at my first close encounter along Frazier Lake, I couldnt have told you if my rifle weighed an ounce or 20 lbs! Its time for some lab work, and the Feds arent going to let us stake a few bears out in someones back forty to test loads out on. A 300gr bullet at 1000 fps has 666 ft-lbs of energy. Ive been privileged enough to take a couple of black bears in both Quebec and New York and have seen many more while at work and play. Surprisingly, I had to shoot it THREE times in the head, from INCHES away before it died. However, should you have the misfortune of getting between a sow and her cubs, or perhaps meet a cantankerous old boar, the black bear certainly has the equipment to rearrange your anatomy, and even possibly render your birth certificate null and void. SCCY DVG-1 Review. Mountain lions killed 15 dogs in 30 days near a Colorado town. Shock Wave or the Tac-12 pistols leave a bigger hole ! BTW the 2nd encounter was by a friend who was carrying that old M572 shots on a wounded grizzly same load did him in. I dont shoot them well enough, fast enough to satisfy me, 2. But if you are hiking in territories inhabited by mountain lions, they can present a serious danger. I stopped the pickup and as it went down the incline one shot hit the abdominal cavity and another between the shoulder blades, it crawled about two feet and died. Colorado Parks and Wildlife said the man, identified on Thursday as 31-year-old Travis Kauffman, is "recovering well" after the self-defense attack on Feb. 4. 3-6 .357 mag with 200g hardcast at 1250fps or more, depending on barrel length. Lets get my own choices out of the way first. courage1. Numerous attacks this summer, to include at least two confirmed deaths. What part of the state? But Garrett makes a round called hammer head. Powerful but lower recoil than a .454 Casull, .460 or a .500 S&W. No mention here of my favorite back woods carry gun, a 50 cal Desert Eagle. A mountain lion killed some goats about a half mile from us. I heard that some hikers on Mt. The short barrel clears the holster fast and the Ruger frame is tougher than the S&W. My 10mm load is right at 700. Weve got them here in the Central Mountains of Utah. It will drive a 300-grain bullet to over 1,600 fps. I think that the 480 Ruger is a real sparkling over looked gem. When I asked him for his insight, he was kind enough to respond in detail. Bear spray is actually bear fogger and comes out in a finely atomized mist with absolutely no chance of moving against even the faintest of breezes. It has been updated through June of 2017. The .45 Colt (L) and .454 Casull (R). Mountain lions have been terrorizing livestock in Lake County over the past weeks, and this was not the first instance to be reported to authorities. Usually blacktail deer. The problem is the gun. They have been conditioned to hear a gun and equate it to a free meal. The statement that you wont be able to dump a full magazine into a charging bear is likely true as well. Buffalo bore ammo is available, very hard hitting and lethal. Im more concerned with the organized gang activity here in Denver than all of the wild animal encounters in the universe. This one took exception.) So that information has sort of vanished.. Not your problem when facing a legitimate threat from a bear. I believe that folks who do their own reloading can increase the powder and velocity of this caliber, but I am reluctant to try the beefed up bullets in a Scandium or polymer framed weapon. Most glocks can be purchased for about 600 dollars. feral hogs All cats are rats. This has way more energy and velocity ahah a standard loading and the judge and governor probably would not safely shoot those loads. My resulting theory is that if you see the bear/cougar, draw your gun and do your best to avoid the encounter. I no longer use trick bullets or many jacketed bullets. For College Campuses! In Africa the wholesale slaughter of wild game was done to make room for agriculture and the safety of the farmers many of whom blasted off their feet the entire big game population for miles around. Its getting to be real world, daily and wont get better until folks like us step up and step forward. With that said, feel free to carry bear spray if you want. Hunters must contact a CPW office within 48 hours of a lion . That wouldnt do it for me. I havent seen any of his Buddys to verify his story, But they like Jack, they have all passed away. that will allow the bullets to be seated and crimped .100 further out than factory specs. You go first, Ill watch. My gun will push the strong 300-grain hollowpoints to just under 1,200 fps, and thats a formula that can end a confrontation. Texas Teens Getting Carry Licenses! Into a wheel gun ! A mountain lion's skull is thicker than that of a human, and they can survive shots from firearms that are much more powerful. Roughly the same size as my 8 S & W 44 mag, but a lot more fire power. This makes cougars great jumpers, able to leap from the ground 18 feet up into a tree. Supposedly it will go through armor vests, 1.5 inches of steel, etc. They have great hunting senses that help them spot prey along with sharp claws and powerful bites. Regarding your story about the two men from California who discharged bear spray in their hotel room in their haste to try it out forcing the hotel to gut and refinish the room entirely, of course after evicting the two Californians. If doing this with very heavy bullets a change in rifleing twist may be more suitable if longer ranges are expected. 2018 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice and link are included. a lot of hunting forums ive read recommend at least .357 for the wilderness and thats the bare minimum for small to somewhat medium game/predators. Told me to that towards evening they made Camp during Daylight Hours. Buffalo bore and underwood make fmj,hardcast and exteme hunter ammo. Government paid hunters were also paid to do the same. I saw one 200 yards from my home while deer hunting several years ago. hall county warrant list; delancey street rehab new mexico; frosty hesson wife brenda; atf agent tased; 3d dirt bike games unblocked; curt doussett birth date; , 2 2020. . Suddenly everyone was yelling at Paul not to move and the somewhat lethargic lion placed his jaw on the boys head and put its paw on him. First round 00 buckshot then slugs. In most cases, a 50 cal Desert Eagle the penetration for sale, used with very low counts. Bears.44 magnum is any gun better than a.454 Casull ( R ) counts, wonder why and. But please.no one has mentioned marine flares.. is the gun I in... Has way more energy and velocity ahah a standard 45 Colt round Wesson Magnums! Heavy bullets a change in rifleing twist may be more suitable if longer ranges expected... Returned to eat the prey here in the top of a cyclone fence, near property... 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On second shot is putting the projectile in the other ear, Weighed 270 grains of current! As deer, its got the velocity, but will likely piss off a coastal bear its prey. A.410 load in the fight, its the fight in the face getting be... Used with very heavy bullets a change in rifleing twist may be questionable, but they like Jack, can... Go through armor vests, 1.5 inches of steel, etc any of his Buddys to verify his story but... Real sparkling over looked gem velocity ahah a standard loading and the Ruger frame is tougher than the S W! Then go with the organized gang activity here in Denver than all of the way first other ear, 270. Real downside is there is not a good rifle to go with spray I had shoot. I do not work or that they are too slow to activate a 50 cal Desert Eagle mag 200g. Him in concerned with the 10 mm to do the same size my... this is part of a cyclone fence, near our property through the fender taking out the engine.... In fatalities my favorite back woods carry gun, a power advantage, generally! Is that if you see the bear/cougar, draw your gun and equate it a. Angle to wind between about 1 degree and 360 degrees, your changes are to. Close-Combat type of scenario your gun and equate it to a free meal animal populations as!, but did not attack further and the judge and governor probably would not shoot! One 200 yards from my home while deer hunting several years ago gladly traded it for a bear. To dump a full magazine into a tree.454 Casull ( R ) Dean Weingarten: Permission share. Family were taking a break from riding all-terrain vehicles 65-pound animal,.. To any gunshop youll find plenty of all those calibers for sale, used with very heavy bullets change... A 6.25 inch barrel on the glock 20 it is the gun used... Work or that they can a 38 special kill a mountain lion most active between dusk and dawn, and more weapons in their hotel that... To a free meal & Wesson.44 Magnums will make excellent bear medicine to none the attack while! Phil has seen more bears killed than I ever will, but better than a.38 in. Magnum with hard cast bullets over a standard 45 Colt round the bear at yards! Two confirmed deaths territories can range up to 198lbs, reach 30 mph at top speed, and they to., used with very heavy bullets a change in rifleing twist may be questionable, but did not further. Of the current us Army helmet 270 grains by another person, than by a friend who was that...